Exploration Local

Celebrating North Carolina's Great Trail State Day with Palmer McIntyre, Author of Trails & Treats

• Mike Andress • Season 1 • Episode 109

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I sit down with advocate and author Palmer McIntyre to explore how North Carolina grew into the Great Trail State—and why that identity now shapes health, local business, and everyday life. 

Palmer shares the story behind Great Trail State Day, the annual October celebration that invites everyone to step onto a nearby path and bring a friend along. We trace the momentum that began during the pandemic, grew through Year of the Trail, and led to more than $61 million in state investment for trail projects and the outdoor recreation economy’s $16.2 billion impact—fueling guides, outfitters, restaurants, lodging, and local tourism—and spotlight Old Fort’s trail expansion as a powerful example of how access can flip a switch for a small town.

We also dig into Trails and Treats, the new guide pairing 30 approachable routes with locally owned eateries across the mountains, Triad, Triangle, and Charlotte. You’ll hear how the authors chose lesser‑known gems to spread use beyond crowded hotspots, why urban greenways count as real adventure, and how food culture helps tell the story of place. If you’ve been waiting for a nudge to get outside—or a reason to try that bakery after your ride—consider this your sign.

Mike Andress
Host, Exploration Local
828-551-9065
mike@explorationlocal.com

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SPEAKER_00:

A trail can change a day, and sometimes it can change a town. Today we're talking with Palmer McIntyre about how North Carolina became known as the Great Trail State and how the guidebook Trails and Treats links accessible trails with Hometown Eats across the mountains, Triad, Triangle, and Charlotte. Trails aren't here just for hiking. They include biking, paddling, equestrian, urban greenways, and natural surface paths. The aim? Connecting people of all ages, abilities, and backgrounds to North Carolina's rich natural, cultural, and historic resources. We'll talk impact, like more people outside for mental and physical health, small towns embracing civic pride, and over$61 million in state investment for trails. Outdoor Recreation now delivers over$16.2 billion to North Carolina's economy, fueling guides, gear shops, restaurants, lodging, experiences, and local tourism. The Great Trail State Coalition champions a future, where you're never very far from a great trail experience and advocates for predictable funding for all trail types, leveraging federal dollars, and supports projects ready for construction across all 100 counties. And with Great Trail State Day coming up this Saturday, October the 18th, it's the perfect moment to join the statewide celebration. Visit Great Trail StateCoalition.org to find an event near you, pick a trail, and invite someone who hasn't been outside in a while. You're listening to Exploration Local, a podcast designed to explore and celebrate the people and places that make the Blue Ridge and Southern Appalachian Mountains special and unique. My name is Mike Andris, the host of Exploration Local. Join us on our journey to explore these mountains and discover how they fuel a spirit of adventure. We encourage you to wander far but explore local. Let's go. Palmer, I am so thrilled to have you here today. Welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_01:

I am thrilled to be here. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00:

Absolutely. We've got a lot to unpack because we have two really big topics here and a really cool book that's sitting right beside me and sits on my nightstand. And then we're also going to talk about this great trail state that's coming up, the great trail state day that's coming up. But to kind of give us a little bit of flavor of what we're going to be getting into here today, Palmer, just a really quick highlight view. What does the Great Trails State Day represent to you?

SPEAKER_01:

Well, it is a day about getting people outside, getting people outside to explore any of the amazing trails we have across North Carolina in any region. It's just a great time of year to be outside in all parts of the state. And we just want to encourage people to just engage with trails wherever they are, either through an event or with a family or friend or community or just on your own. So it can be anything.

SPEAKER_00:

Awesome. And we're going to talk a little bit more about what those trails look like because sometimes when we think of trails, we just think of the little dirt and the, you know, the grass or the gravel that we're walking across. But in our state, we have a lot of really, really cool trails, and we'll talk about that in a little bit. So how did this annual celebration get started? And how do you see people participating in it this year?

SPEAKER_01:

Well, it got started back in 2023. And in 2023, we were celebrating North Carolina Year of the Trail. That was a big deal. It was a statewide celebration of trails, the first time we'd ever done anything like this. We did it on a very big scale. And our whole goal was to raise the profile and awareness about trails all across the state and all communities because we want people to be more engaged and aware and communities to be more connected to trails. And so we wanted to have this day near the end of the year to sort of bookend it. And we thought, let's have a great trail state day. October's a great month. Um, let's do it. It actually became official in 2024 through the Farm Act. Um, so now it is an official state day and will always be the third Saturday of October.

SPEAKER_00:

Nice.

SPEAKER_01:

And um, we're grateful for the state's support in that. So we have a thing, and it's great trail state day.

SPEAKER_00:

I love it. I love it. So why do you think North Carolina's trail culture really resonates so deeply with people, especially right now? Why do you think that's the case?

SPEAKER_01:

Well, I think it goes back to the COVID pandemic in 2020 when people were really trying to find safe spaces to be, and it was the outdoors. People really discovered the outdoors with their pods, with their families, with their groups of people they were hanging around. And that just put a great emphasis on the benefits of these trails. People felt better when they were outside, they were moving their bodies, um, so they could sort of see those direct impacts. And I so I think it that awareness goes back to then and the timing with Year of the Trail, with this great trail state day, it's all building on that initial momentum. And I just think there's there's much increased awareness about the benefits of trails for communities across the state.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, so true. And even, you know, just beyond a day, you and I were talking the other day, and one of the things that we had just kind of mentioned or talked about was just the mental health aspect that comes from being outside and being on these trails. And we mentioned some of the new greenway trails that are like here in my town, like the Acosta Trail, uh, and there's so many others that are going on, you know, across the state. But yeah, it just since COVID for sure, you feel like people are really looking to the outdoors. And you, I don't know if this was part of the motivation behind it, but your awesome book, Trails and Treats, it's a hiker and runner's guide to great trails and goodieats in North Carolina. And I can't think of a better time to be talking about this book, especially looking at the Great Trail State Day just a just a few weeks away.

SPEAKER_01:

Well, we were super excited to bring this book into the world, and it was a long time in coming. In fact, the idea surfaced with a good friend of mine, Hollis Oberlees. We wrote it together, and she approached me about it in 2021, and I thought, oh, perfect timing. Year of the trails coming, we can get this thing done and launch at about that time. And of course, that never happened. It took three and a half years to get the book done. But the timing was great, and it really is a unique guide because it combines trails with additional places. I mean, normally you've had trail guides and then you've had food guides, but this puts it all together into one, so it's a unique product out there.

SPEAKER_00:

What was your process for choosing which trails and what eateries made it into the book?

SPEAKER_01:

Well, that's a great question because there are probably a thousand trails across North Carolina, and it's kind of like, oh, picking your favorite child. But we wanted to pick trails in in certain regions of the state. We we had there are four regions we picked the mountains, the triad, the triangle, and Charlotte, because that's where most of the population of the state is located. And there aren't as many trails in the eastern part of the state. Um, so we picked those four regions and we wanted to pick a variety of trails that kind of represented um everything from iconic, you can't miss this. If you haven't been on one of the this trail, you really need to go to those kind of secret gyms that people might not know about. So it really is a wide range of trails, and they're all very doable. Like nothing is crazy hard or just too easy. It's a nice, it's a nice range for experienced trail users, but also for people new to trails. So it's a book that speaks to a lot of different levels of trail users. And then for the places to eat, um, that was really fun. And we wanted to go to places that were locally owned, that welcomed people in that might be a little, you know, sweaty, um, might have a dog. I mean, we talk about which places welcome dogs. Um, so and and they've been around for a while. So, you know, a lot of these places survived through the pandemic. So they've got some staying power with them, but we really wanted that local feel. And and so we have more than 70, we call them treats in the book. And they're anything from like bakeries, coffee shops, pizza joints, uh brewery, you know, there's a wide variety of places, but and it's really meant to just give some inspiration too, because there's there's gazillions more, but but we thought it was just fun to the ones we have in there we really enjoyed.

SPEAKER_00:

And you know, something you said, I don't know if I misheard you or not, but it definitely makes sense to me if you did, if I did understand this. So you can go to some guy books sometimes or look on some social media influencers and profiles, and a lot of times you see the same things over and over and over and over and over again. But when I look at your book, there's a lot of trails in here, quite honestly, I've never heard of before. And so, not that I know all the trails all the way around, you know, all around, but you've really kind of identified some unique trails, some new trails, some ways to experience maybe a region that people haven't ever explored before. Was that intentional?

SPEAKER_01:

That was intentional, yeah. Because like I said, we wanted to, we don't want to overcrowd places that are already overcrowded. I mean, there are a few iconic trails that get really busy, and we talk about how it's good to go visit trails at off times. I mean, like a peak Saturday in October, you know, you just need to pick and choose where you go because it's could be really busy and be expect that. But but yeah, we did want to show that diversity, and we have it have a diversity of land managers in there too. I mean, there's some that are national forests, there's some that are state parks, some that are local governments, some that are land trusts, some of the, you know, private nature preserves with land trusts that are open to the public. But so it is a wide variety of different types of trails and different features, like some have views, some have water, some have historical elements to them. So it meant it was really meant to be a variety. And we feature three urban trails. So you might not think about an urban trail as a trail experience, but like greenways and town and cities, and that there's always art involved in these trails. It's interesting, and you're right next to a lot of great restaurants and places to go. So it can be that can be its own adventure outdoors, but it's just a little bit more urban than say a trail back in the forest.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. Well, I love that because it expands our view of what we think trails are, and sometimes we just think it's these big high peaks that we have to go walk and you know and get dirty and drive for hours. But sometimes that's all that stuff is literally right there in our backyard or in a region right next to us that that we haven't discovered yet. And speaking of that, I'm really curious to know if any of these sort of pairings really kind of surprised you, or you felt like you found this hidden gem, like you discovered this hidden gem of a of a place to hike.

SPEAKER_01:

Well, yes. I mean, we discovered a lot of gems. And so for us, we both live in Greensboro, and uh we've both spent a lot of time in the mountains. And Hollis, my co-author, used to live in the triangle. Um, so it was very fun for both of us to discover trails in the Charlotte area because that was new to us. But in a was what was really fun was discovering the little communities around these trails. And it was one time we were down there doing a day of field work and we ended up with a flat tire. When we went to get it fixed, we learned about the town of Matthews. It was right there in Matthews. We'd never been to Matthews before, and it was the cutest town with some really great restaurants and brew pubs. So that that was a fun accident, you know, that that led to the discovery of a trail and some treats that ended up being featured in the book. But some beautiful places like Fonta Flora Brewery in Whipperwill. I mean, that is is a stunning place. Um, there's so many, many places, and some some ones we really knew we wanted in the book, like Google Healt Bakery and Durham. They also have a place in Chapel Hill, but you know, you can and fosters market. I mean, those are just places you can't miss if you're in that area because they're very special and very distinct, if you will.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah. And it also sounds like these are some of these trails are really kind of for every ability level. Like you didn't write this book for a specific population. It's almost like you wrote this writ you wrote this book for many populations and user group.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, and I really feel like um all these books are are accessible to people of all abilities and backgrounds. They may not be accessible to to say wheelchairs or you know, rolled devices, but um, but they're all like no matter what your age or your background, there's a piece of all of these trails that you could experience and enjoy.

SPEAKER_00:

That's great.

SPEAKER_01:

Regardless of your ability.

SPEAKER_00:

I love that. You mentioned or you touched on this just a little bit, and I know this is near and dear to your heart, but how does food and these local places really and you know, these trails really help to tell a story of a trail or a community, Palmer?

SPEAKER_01:

Well, I mean, first of all, Hollis and I both love to eat. So, and I and I think I'll have to say that the give her the credit for the inspiration for the book. Nice. Um, she was really loves the oatmeal raising cookies from Weaver Street Market. And Weaver Street Market has uh one of their bakeries actually in Hillsborough. They also have stores in Chapo Hill, and I think Raleigh too now. Um so she was trying to figure out a way to go get some more of these oatmeal raising cookies that she loves so much, but she needed to also get some exercise so she could enjoy them guilt-free. And so um she paired it with a visit to the Okinee Speedway, which is right there in Hillsborough. It's a cool, um, I don't know if you heard familiar with it, but it's it's a NASCAR, former NASCAR track. It's it's really cool. So that was one of that was the original pairing of the book and really the inspiration behind the book. And and so I think, you know, that's we both love food. We both love to ex go get the outside and do adventures together, and it's just a natural combination for both of us. We also include some healthy recipes in the book, and um, they're kind of sprinkled in throughout the chapters, and there's things you can make and eat before you go, or make and tuck into your bag so you can munch on while you're on the trail. So it's just another option for combining good and healthy foods with your outdoor adventure.

SPEAKER_00:

Yes, and your sunrise egg cups, we did this. Um yep, absolutely. It's on page 155 of the book, in fact. Yep, we that's exactly what we did on for a hike.

SPEAKER_01:

Perfect. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

All right, I know we want to get into the Great Trail State Day. Maybe one last thing about this book. What do you hope readers take away from trails and treats beyond just trip ideas and beyond just places to eat? Whether, you know, anything else that you hope readers would take away with this?

SPEAKER_01:

Well, I think what we really want to do is inspire people. I mean, it's only 30 trails, so it's not the whole state, and it can get you started, but I think it's also to help encourage people who maybe haven't experienced trails before to just give it a try and start where you're at, and you can build and you can go on to other things too. But hopefully this book can help people get started and help people who might already be started to discover some new places. So it really came out of a point of inspiration because both of us have benefited so much from our time outdoors, growing up with families who provided outdoor experiences for us when we were young. And so it's just it's part of our life, and we just want to share that joy with others.

SPEAKER_00:

I absolutely love that. And the book you can purchase this book on uh Amazon, you can purchase it at other places as well. Is there like a landing page for this book?

SPEAKER_01:

Is there Yeah, trailsandtreats.com. There you go. Yeah, trails and and is spelled out and d. And it's all it's available in a lot of local retailers too, like REI stores, great outdoor provision stores, um, Mass General stores around the state, and a lot of local bookstores.

SPEAKER_00:

Definitely support one of your local outfitters and your local guide services that are carrying this book. They are really the true heartbeat of a lot of our communities when it comes to gear in the outdoors, information, and all things related to the outdoors, really. All right, so let's pivot and let's talk about this Great Trail State initiative. This is a really big deal. And I know that we get excited about this because we are in North Carolina, but we have listeners in, I think the last count was like 2,400 different cities across the United States and then in Europe as well. And so they may not necessarily know this moniker, the Great Trail State, here in North Carolina. Um, I wonder if you can kind of tee that up again just a little bit. And then what has been your role in this, Palmer?

SPEAKER_01:

Well, the Great Trail State name really has come out of it's building on, I guess, North Carolina's reputation as the Good Road State, which was a grassroots effort to help farmers get their goods to market. And so North Carolina's always been known as the Good Road State. But we wanted to bring that to the next level and say that we are the great trail state and we truly believe it. Um we are working on fulfilling that vision. And um, there are trails in all corners of the state. We'd love to see trails in all 100 counties, but it really is about delivering the benefits of trails to all 100 counties across the state. And, you know, we talked about those benefits earlier, but it's the health and wellness, but it's also the economic development benefits. It's um not every town can have a factory. Um, in fact, a lot of our small communities have lost their manufacturing base and they're starting to look around and say, what do we have? And we have some amazing natural assets. And how can we leverage those assets for tourism? And people come to North Carolina, people live in North Carolina because they love our landscapes and they love our outdoor recreation opportunities. And so it's helping leverage that and dispersing people across and different communities to enjoy those particular activities. And the way I got involved in it is my day job is with Piedmont Lane Conservancy. I um I grew up in Greensboro, left for a long time because the grass is always green on the other side of the fence, and had to had to do that in order to appreciate North Carolina. So when I landed back here in Greensboro, um, I started working with Piedmont Lane Conservancy. And one of the things we do is um provide trails through our nature preserves. And as part of that, we organized a regional initiative where people, our different partners across the region were just like, we there aren't enough resources to do the work around trails. And so started connecting with other people across the state and decided that let's do something as a at the state level, let's get everyone together because people have been working in their silos and let's break those barriers down, get together, and with one unified voice, maybe we can have an impact to show our state leaders that an investment in trail infrastructure is an investment that delivers a really high return. And so that's what we've been working on since about 2020. And I just volunteered to help lead it. So um so I kind of by accident, I mean, just kind of fell into that. But I've been helping lead it with an amazing team of people from across the state, including Iona McInna Thomas with McAdams and Beth Heiley, who you've interviewed before, and many, many, many others. It's it's definitely a team effort, but we've made a ton of progress, Mike, and we've secured over$60 million for trails since 2020 through the General Assembly, and that's that's gonna deliver amazing impact for communities across the state. It is mind-blowing.

SPEAKER_00:

That's mind blowing.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, it's the first time. Um it's the first time that we've gotten that type of funding. Um, the that that the state of North Carolina has invested that type of funding.

SPEAKER_00:

So aggregate, what was that number again? 60 million?

SPEAKER_01:

Over 61 million dollars. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Wow.

SPEAKER_01:

Yep.

SPEAKER_00:

So naturally, or obviously it's not just you and I and others that get excited about this being the great trail state, but our state legislatures have really sort of come through, and this is this is truly an all-in, all hands on board, all hands on deck, so to speak, um, effort to really raise our state to really the moniker that it deserves being the great trail state. And you mentioned a lot of people come to North Carolina to visit, and obviously that's very true. One of the things that um you just shared with me, which I mean, I knew the outdoor recreation added about$14 million to the North Carolina's economy, but I was blown away when you said, Yeah, Mike, just go ahead and add 2.2 more million dollars billion or dollars onto that because we're up to 16.2 billion is what outdoor recreation adds to our economy. That's huge.

SPEAKER_01:

It is huge. And it's you know, it's a lot of different things. It's guiding services or uh provision companies, you know, renting out equipment, it's bed and brick, Airbnbs, restaurants. I mean, all that like relates to the outdoor economy. It is an ecosystem. There's lots of different pieces to it. But but and tourism is up in North Carolina too. I mean, that keeps growing. Um, visit and see does a great job marketing our state, but um more and more people come to North Carolina to vacation.

SPEAKER_00:

Are there any challenges you feel like you still face in connecting and maintaining trails statewide?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, the there are challenges. And I think one of the first challenges is helping elected leaders understand that investing in this type of infrastructure is is really important and should be included as as you think through roads and sewer and sidewalks and such. I mean, it's a critical part of community infrastructure. So plan for that. Because whenever you do a parks and rec survey, um, people always put trails at the top. I mean, that is the most popular thing. More people engage and can engage in that type of activity activity than any other sporting facility. Yeah. Um, so it's it's a very popular thing. People want safe places to walk and to run and to ride their bikes. Um, so helping just demonstrate the importance of investment in that type of infrastructure. Then, of course, funding is a challenge. I mean, it's always a challenge. There's so much competition for funding. And so it's helping deliver the message that you know, you spend a dollar on a trail, you'll get back more than that every year because there are new businesses that spring up around that trail. You mentioned the Acousta Trail there, and there's already a lot of businesses around the Acosta Trail that are popping up, and people come do the trail, they go visit those businesses. I mean, that's economic impact. So it's an investment that that delivers, is what we're trying to demonstrate.

SPEAKER_00:

That's exactly right. And you also mentioned earlier that some of these communities that may not have manufacturing or other large, large draws that way economically, that that these outdoor places, these natural assets can be really kind of a bolster to local economies and and communities. And I'm wondering, like besides the Acousta, is there an example of a project or maybe even a community that's really benefiting from this initiative of the Great Trail State?

SPEAKER_01:

I think there are many examples, but one I'll point out is the town of Old Fort. There wasn't a whole lot going on in Old Fort a decade or more ago. Um, there's been partners in in the community who have been working together to develop a network of trails in the national forest, which butts up right against Piscah National Forest, is right against Old Fort. And so they had the vision that we create this infrastructure, we'll bring people into our community, and our community will prosper and thrive. And I was just speaking to one of the partners there, Jason McDougall, who um works at Camp Greer and leads G5 Trail Collective. And he his quote, his direct quote was like someone flipped a switch in Old Fort. You know, they got miles, 20 some miles of this trail infrastructure developed, and it's like someone flipped a switch because all the lots of new businesses came into town. It became a thriving place. Hard to find a place to park sometimes. So that's just a demonstration of what trails can do for a community.

SPEAKER_00:

I love it. Love it. All right, well, let's uh focus a little bit on the actual day of celebration here. I know it's been all over your socials, and um I love seeing it. The Great Trail State Day is going to be Saturday, October the 18th. And how can people get involved with this? How can they find out more? And how can they just be completely engaged with this whole day?

SPEAKER_01:

Well, the first suggestion is to follow us on social media at Great Trails NC. And there we have a lot of suggestions and inspiration at our website, which is greattrailsnc.com. There is an events tab, and there are a lot of events going on across the state. Um, so you can maybe find something to do there. And then the third thing is just to look around where you are and see if there's a new trail you'd like to try or an old favorite and invite a friend who maybe hasn't been on that trail before and just get outside and enjoy the day.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh, great suggestions. I absolutely love that. It really sounds like we're not just building trails in North Carolina, but really kind of building community and belonging. And I think that ties beautifully back to your book. So we could also use your book as a great reference tool to participate in the Great Trail State Day as well, right?

SPEAKER_01:

Absolutely. I hope you can.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh, that's good. That's good. I'm I'm curious about stories, stories from the trail, stories from communities, from hikers and businesses. I know you mentioned Jason, uh, and I know those others that are probably the tip of the tongue for you, but who else are you hearing from about how these trails are driving this bigger trail movement here in North Carolina, Palmer?

SPEAKER_01:

Well, that is a big question. And um we did we wrote a lot of stories during Year of the Trail um in the form of blogs. And they were stories about people, and so not necessarily like, oh, the you know, we grew 13 businesses in five years in a certain town. Not necessarily that, but a story about people. And one of them in particular, I remember a woman who she had a streak, and a street, you know, some some people know streaks about social media where you're on social media and you don't stop. But no, this is a streak where she was doing an outdoor activity um every day for um the every day during year of the trail. And so she found a trail activity, whether even if she was out of town for work, she would find space in that day to spend a little bit of time on a trail. And that was transformational for her. And then there's the Kahari tribe down in eastern North Carolina where they were uncleaning up and developing a river trail and getting their youth involved and just seeing the changes in the community where they were investing in this incredible natural asset and the impact that had on the young people in that community. And I mean, I could go on and on about the stories. Um, there's the group Find um in Western North Carolina, where they had a program where they were bringing um Hispanic kids and their families out on outdoor adventures and just life-changing. Um, just there's so so many stories to tell. And I encourage people to go look at our website and read some of those stories at great trailsnc.com.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, absolutely. And I'd be remiss if we didn't actually cover what trails are included because it's not just like as we mentioned earlier, trails I'm walking on, but we're talking about blue ways, greenways, and and trails. These are all things that are making up the trails in our great trail state, right?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, when we say the word trail, it is very expansive. So it is paved trails, natural surface trails that you can hike or mountain bike on. Um it's equine trails, it's paddle trails where you might be paddling a canoe or kayak. Um, so we can't say muscle powered trails. Um, so that that is what the universe of trails that we are trying to promote.

SPEAKER_00:

Any idea of the total number of miles of trails that we have in North Carolina? Did you know I was going to ask that?

SPEAKER_01:

Oh no, but it's so hard to say. I honestly don't know. We don't there is not one comprehensive map of trails in North Carolina. And the reason is because that is not an easy product to create. I bet. Um, it because you have different land managers, the data sets, I mean, it's very, very complicated. In fact, it was we have maps in our book of all the different trails, and it was it was a big job to get all that data to create those maps. But um, you know, you can use an app like trail forks or all trails, or you know, you can sort of see that there are there are just a lot, there are thousands of trails across the state, probably. Um, but I honestly I can't even begin to even guess how many miles of trails.

SPEAKER_00:

A lot, a lot of miles.

SPEAKER_01:

A lot, a lot, and more to come.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's right, that's right. In fact, I am curious to know like when you look into the foreseeable future, what do you hope that we'll be celebrating about North Carolina's trails, say 10, 15 years from now?

SPEAKER_01:

Well, our hope. So speaking from the voice of the coalition, our hope is that there is a recurring funding source for trails. The state has some other funds for parks and for conservation, like that part F, it's called Parks and Recreation Trust Fund. And then there's the Land and Water Conservation Fund. Those are recurring. So we would love to see the Great Trails State program be a recurring fund that any community can apply to for grant funding to advance their projects. And then the other thing is that we really truly live up to this moniker of North Carolina being the Great Trails State. And that's something that everyone recognizes. I mean, everyone recognizes that Virginia is for lovers. I mean, it just rolls off your tongue, you know about it. But we want everyone to recognize that North Carolina is the Great Trail state. So I'd love to see a combination of those two things and just more people getting outdoors and learning about and caring for, because stewardship is part of this. We want to care for these spaces that we're inviting people into to experience. But just more people engaged in the caring of them and the experiencing of them and valuing them. So that's there you go. That's my hope.

SPEAKER_00:

I love that. That's a huge hope. Are there any particular projects that you're especially excited about? Some that you may not be able to talk about.

SPEAKER_01:

No, I can. So in our region, again, going back to my my job with Pete Mont Lane Conservancy, you know, we've been working on in this idea to connect Greensboro to Winston-Salem through Kernersville with a with a trail, a regional greenway. And it's trail projects are hard. I mean, they take a lot of planning, they take a lot of time, and especially where they go across multiple jurisdictions and lots of different landowners and so forth. And so that's that is something I'm hopeful to see some progress on. Um that would be a great alternative to the white knuckle I-40 experience that many people did getting between those two cities. So that that is a a particular hope of mine is to see that project advance.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh, that's so cool. Well, I hope it does, um, for sure, because um just a small example, we used to live in Virginia years ago, and there was a, I think it was called the Virginia Capital Trail. And I remember back in gosh, the early 2000s, the idea, and I'm sure that the the genesis of that idea came like way before then, but there was an idea that they wanted to c uh connect like 52 miles from Williamsburg, Virginia to Richmond. And that, you know, I remember riding sections of that right behind my house, you know, as far up to the river, Chickahominy River that I could, but now going back into Virginia, you see that that trail is is complete. And it's amazing being able to drive through little small wooded areas, you know, to farmlands, to the urban area. Um, you talk about a way to really kind of experience where you live in an entirely new way. I mean, that is that is it. And these trails are just ways to do that. They're just trails are ways to connect not only communities, but just people within those communities too, I think.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, and it's not just about transportation, although it is, but in addition to that, it becomes an attraction. And, you know, people visit Williamsburg and Richmond just to just to go on that trail, too. So that's where you get your benefit from, too. Just it makes a community a nice place to live, a really nice place to live when you can go out and have that kind of experience.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, you're so right. And you know, again, just another small example from me, and we talked about the Acousta Trail not too long ago, but you know, that trail, when I go on it and I see the number of people that are, you know, clearly these bikes that were pulled out of the garage, they've been in there for years, but they're out there, they're riding, and you have people, you know, walking, and you know, my girls, it's amazing, you know, in the afternoon. I I can look up and friend finder where they are, and and and nine times out of ten, they're gonna be at the acousta market hanging right at the acousta trail. And, you know, there's people that are just on rollerblades and skateboards and bikes and walking and families and you know, all ages. It's just I'm seeing it firsthand. Like I I feel like I've been aware of it with you know, the things we're talking about and the impact that you're you're referring to. But when you experience it, it's it's it's life-changing, to be honest with you, because you're thinking about not just yourself, but I'm thinking about our community as a whole and the way that it's just drawing, and then and then you're running into people, you're like, gosh, I haven't seen them in a long time, and all of a sudden here they are on the Acoustic Trail. That's what trails do for us.

SPEAKER_01:

It's like a central park in a way, isn't it? It brings people together.

SPEAKER_00:

Absolutely does. Well, Palmer, I have absolutely thoroughly enjoyed this conversation, and I know that we could go a lot deeper on both of these topics, but um, before I let you go, is there anything that you really would love for people to understand, both about your book or about the Great Trail State Day or the Great Trail State in general?

SPEAKER_01:

Well, I mean, I think we've covered it, but I really do hope that we can see trails in all 100 counties and see all communities benefit from trails in the future. And um, yeah, just get out, get out there and discover it. And hopefully the book can be a resource and a tool to just to be a launching pad for for great adventures for your families and your friends and yourself, and we'll all enjoy it because we live in a wonderful place.

SPEAKER_00:

Oh, so well said. Well, Palmer, listen, thank you so much for joining me today and really for everything that you're doing to help North Carolinians connect with trails, food, and and these shared experiences. Thanks so much for what you do and your team. I know that it's not alone, but I really appreciate all that you all are doing together.

SPEAKER_01:

Well, thank you so much, Mike, and happy Great Trail State Day to you.

SPEAKER_00:

Happy Great Trail State to you, too. North Carolina truly is the Great Trail State. Thanks to the communities, volunteers, and trail advocates working together to make sure everyone has a place to wander. As we celebrate Great Trail State Day, remember that every mile matters, from the greenways that connect neighborhoods to the rugged backcountry paths that connect us to nature. Visit Great Trail State Coalition.org to discover events near you, learn how to get involved, or support the statewide effort to promote trails thriving in all 100 counties. If Trails and Shrie inspires your next outing, share your favorite trail and street pairing with us on social media. And if you participate in the Great Trail State Day, be sure to share your adventures using the tags at Great Trails North Carolina, hashtag Great TrailsNorth Carolina, and hashtag Great TrailState. So the celebration and the trails get the spotlight that they deserve. Well, thanks for tuning in. If you enjoyed today's conversation, please leave me a review and don't forget to subscribe so you don't miss the next episode. Follow me on Instagram and Facebook and drop me a note at Mike at explorationlocal.com if you ever have ideas for future episodes, or if you just want to say hello. That's gonna do it for this episode. As I always say, I encourage you to wander far but explore local, especially on this Great Trail State Day.